If Muhammad Ali was never born..

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
13 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Left Hook From Hell...
Let's say his dad's sperm never hit the egg that spawned "The Greatest." This would certainly change the landscape of boxing history. Who would be recongnized as the best fighter ever? I think in this case Joe Louis would finally be able to step out of Ali's shadow and be recognized as the best heavyweight champion.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Will69
Good question.  Louis probably would, but in time, he would fade into the background.  Jack Johnson was probably considered the greatest, perhaps even by some in Louis' time.  Jack Dempsey was thought of similarly.  But today, people just know them as part of boxing academia.  I'm sure 50 years from now, a HW will be near 270lbs, 6'7.  People would look at Louis and Ali as skinny little guys, who never faced anyone good of current size.  Heck, they may even call Lewis or the Klits as skinny as they weighed around 240-245lbs.  

Also, don't discount hype and fame around boxers influencing their ranking.  Ibragamov, Povetkin, and others are arguably great boxers but are not remembered anywhere because they had limited or no hype.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Duggerman
Administrator
Hmmm...if there was no Ali, I think it may well come down to Liston or Foreman. Think about it; how long would Sonny have dominated if there was no Ali to upset him? The only person around who would eventually be a threat would be a peaking Joe Frazier in the late '60s, but despite his advancing age, I'd still pick Liston over Joe. Realistically Sonny might reign until Foreman came along, though it's possible that Sonny would beat the novice Foreman, especially if the sparring stories between them are true.

But let's say Foreman beat Liston; how long does Foreman reign? I think it's possible that Larry Holmes would beat him in the late '70s.

I think Louis, Marciano, Dempsey and Johnson would still be well respected, but Foreman and/or Liston would have much stronger legacies if there was no Ali to upset them, which would allow them also to have much longer reigns as champ and maintain their auras of being "invincible."
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Zorro
It would come down to Liston, Foreman and Louis. No one beats Louis' reign, but as said earlier, Sonny and Foreman would have dominated much longer if not for succumbing to Ali.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Duggerman
Administrator
Yeah. I feel like Ali and Tyson overshadowed most heavyweights, and the history of boxing would be much different had they not existed.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

It's Dale
It would probably come down to Liston and Foreman. Joe Louis would still reign above them. But more modern giants heavyweights like Lewis and the Klitschkos would likely beat Liston and Foreman. But Louis would probably still go down as the GOAT with no Ali around to eclipse him.

With no Ali around, a lot of other fighters from his era would get more shine.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Malik Wright
Mike Tyson would get ALL the glory, dawg.
Malik El Debarge Wright
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Hit Em' Hard
Malik Wright wrote
Mike Tyson would get ALL the glory, dawg.
That is more true than you realize. Even today there are a lot of people who feel that Tyson was better and more exciting than Ali was. Tyson regenerated boxing when he came out.

So if there was no Ali, Tyson would hands down be labeled the GOAT although Louis would still have a lot of fans also
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Duggerman
Administrator
Hit Em' Hard wrote

That is more true than you realize. Even today there are a lot of people who feel that Tyson was better and more exciting than Ali was. Tyson regenerated boxing when he came out.

So if there was no Ali, Tyson would hands down be labeled the GOAT although Louis would still have a lot of fans also
Given how people favor the more recently hyped, I bet folks would pick Iron Mike to demolish the smaller heavyweight champions of old, like Louis, Johnson, Dempsey, Marciano, etc.

Therefore they may feel that the GOAT would come down to Tyson versus Foreman or Liston, depending on whose legacy was stronger with no Ali present.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Phantom Punch
In reply to this post by Left Hook From Hell...
Left Hook From Hell... wrote
Let's say his dad's sperm never hit the egg that spawned "The Greatest." This would certainly change the landscape of boxing history. Who would be recongnized as the best fighter ever? I think in this case Joe Louis would finally be able to step out of Ali's shadow and be recognized as the best heavyweight champion.
I say Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano and Jack Johnson. They'd have a sealed place in history, especially Louis and Marciano.  

Regarding Liston and Foreman: They both had sudden falls from grace because of Ali humiliating them. Without Ali around I agree that they would have reigned much longer during their championship reigns. But how they lost the title would be what affects their legacies. Liston and Foreman were both overconfident, so if some random guy pulled a "Buster Douglas" and caught them slipping, their legacies would suffer even more. Even if they won the rematch, their invincible aura would be over and they'd still look beatable and vulnerable.

Lennox Lewis and the Klitschkos would probably get more praise too, but let's not forget Iron Mike.
Without Ali, the most popular champions would be Joe Louis and Mike Tyson, rather than Ali and Mike Tyson, which is how it currently stands.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Entaowed
Banned User
This post was updated on .
CONTENTS DELETED
The author has deleted this message.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Leo the Lion
Liston becomes the GOAT. He stylistically beats Frazier. Based on sparring stories he beats Foreman. He beats guys like Quarry, Bonavena, maybe Norton and Shavers at the end of his Career.

No doubt in my mind he reigns until he's old enough to lose, but that doesn't detract from his legacy because people note that he lost in declining age.
Leo Rothmann - Amateur Boxer 183lbs
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: If Muhammad Ali was never born..

Duggerman
Administrator
Leo the Lion wrote
Liston becomes the GOAT. He stylistically beats Frazier. Based on sparring stories he beats Foreman. He beats guys like Quarry, Bonavena, maybe Norton and Shavers at the end of his Career.

No doubt in my mind he reigns until he's old enough to lose, but that doesn't detract from his legacy because people note that he lost in declining age.
What about Joe Louis though? Even if you pick Liston to beat Louis head to head, Louis would still have his legacy of 25 title defenses and an 11 year title run.

And then there's Rocky Marciano's 49-0 record. I think Louis and Marciano would already naturally overshadow The Big Bear.