Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

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Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Will69
This post was updated on .
If you look at Tyson's record, he beat everyone under 6'3", (except Holyfield, which was well after Tyson's peak). Not only did he beat these guys, he mostly knocked them TFO. My question is, can you say that a peak Tyson can beat ANY boxer under 6'3" in history? If not, explain yourself.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Duggerman
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That is a great observation, Will. I’ll be back with more detail later, but there are a few guys under 6’3 I’d pick to beat peak Tyson. Louis and Liston spring to mind first. Possibly Ike Ibeabuchi. We’ll never quite know how good that guy was.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Will69
This post was updated on .
Yes, AJ, please give this a good hard think and let me know your analysis. (You too Michael and others). To be honest, I thought the only two people that could upset my theory would be Holyfield and Ike! But, my quick knee-jerk responses to those would be:

Tyson would go 12 rounds with Evander and come out on top because a prime Mike would be working in more combinations rather than mainly head-hunting. And, Evander would not be settled enough to man-handle him like he did in the 90s. Mike was also more unpredictable in the 80s, which, from memory, was a big reason Holyfield won both those fights in the 90s. Finally, although Mike was still quite fast when he met Holyfield in the ring, he did not have the same blistering speed he had in the 80s.

For Ike, it too would go 12 rounds, and I don't think Mike could KO Ike, or intimidate him, or man-handle him. I think with Mike's speed, he would get more punches in and get the nod of the judges in the end. As well, I could see Mike bobbing and weaving a lot to make Ike not land flush with a lot of his punches. (not unlike how Ike himself slipped some of Tua's bombs in their fight in '97)

Now, for Sonny, I haven't thought of that scenario. I do agree, Sonny had the skill and size to possibly handle a prime Mike. But I have to think about that one more.... Louis similarly may be able to dart in and out of Mike's range for a few rounds, but I'm more inclined to imagine a similar ending like when an aged Louis fought Rocky. A prime Tyson that threw combinations would be difficult for any one under 220lbs to handle.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Duggerman
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Given Tyson’s popularity, the judges would likely favor Tyson in a close war with Ibeabuchi. If Tua couldn’t kayo Ike then I doubt Tyson could. But on my scorecard, Tua only lost the fight because he lost the first four rounds. He didn’t start adjusting to Ike’s jab until the mid rounds and that’s when he stepped up. Tyson was a fast starter so he might perform the opposite of Tua...blazing fiercely in the early rounds but slowing in the later ones.

As for Liston, I could imagine Tyson blasting Liston outta there with a punch or combination Sonny doesn’t see coming. But given Tyson’s questionable confidence and Liston’s jab and reach, I would pick Sonny to eventually demolish Tyson first.

Are you a fan of Louis, Will? I noticed you generally underrate him, and on this topic you have his style wrong. Louis wouldn’t be darting in and out versus Tyson. Louis was not a stick and move guy. He was a boxer-puncher with firmly planted feet. He could use his jab and technical skill to counter and outbox Mike, and remember that his hand speed was just as fast as Mike’s, so he could go toe to toe up close.

Louis had it all and plenty more in his arsenal than Tyson did.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Will69
Good comments AJ. I like Louis, Dempsey, and Rocky, but I don't follow them as much as boxers from the 70s-90s. Now that I think about it it, I agree that Louis would be trying to counter and outbox Mike, rather than stick and move. But as much as I like these guys, I think they would be challenged against Mike. Similarly, as much as I like Ali, Fraizer, Foreman, I think these guys would be challenged against Lewis or the Klits. But getting back to the topic, is there anyone else under 6'3" who could take a prime Tyson?
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Duggerman
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I’ll admit that Tua was a poor man’s version of Tyson. Though I would slightly favor Tyson over him in a fight, anything can happen when two inside fighters meet in the center of the ring. Whoever backs up would lose, and this would probably be Mike, who was forced backwards and made uncomfortable by opponents much more than Tua was. But Tua was also a lazy fighter at times and might just stand there and let Tyson whoop him. In any case, Tua deserves a mention.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Rosco
Chris Byrd could take a hell of a punch and was hard to catch. You could argue Tyson was more aggressive at times than Tua but there's little doubt to me that a Tyson-Byrd fight would be disimilar.

Louis would knock Mike out.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Will69
Chris Byrd defeating a prime Mike? That one may be pushing it, IMHO. Tyson, in his prime, was a lot more slippery himself than he was in the 90s, and could come at you from anywhere, unlike Tua. I think Byrd would be Koed in 8. Chris wouldn't have the height to escape Tyson's bombs. Also, I think people are forgetting that I'm talking about a prime Tyson here. Not the Tyson that was the pay-check fighter, and mentally imploded in the 90s. The Tyson I'm talking about battered Berbick for 4 rounds and put him on the canvas a few times. And Berbick went 15 rounds against a prime Holmes! This is also the Tyson that beat up Holmes and put him down several times before knocking him TFO! (Something Holyfield couldn't remotely do).
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Entaowed
Banned User
This post was updated on .
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Will69
So to summarize so far, the only person most of us agree that might have a real shot (although still with a degree of uncertainty) is Sonny Liston.

Next on the "common" list, although even more uncertain, is Ike Ibeabuchi
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Duggerman
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I’m more confident in Louis beating Mike than Sonny. Tyson fought in predictable patterns that Louis and his trainer Jack Blackburn would LOVE to exploit. Louis had hands just as fast as Mike and had the same accuracy and explosive power in both fists. Against Louis, Tyson would be fighting a tougher, much more technically skilled, smarter and more rounded version of himself. There is always the chance Tyson surprises Louis and scores a sudden knockout but Louis had too much in his arsenal and would be wise enough to get off first.

Regarding Sonny, he is a favorite over Tyson too. Tyson was quoted once saying that the one heavyweight who might intimidate him would be Sonny. But with Tyson’s much faster hands it’s possible he surprises Sonny and scores a sudden knockout.

Think of this also...Floyd Patterson (another peek-a-boo fighter) may have been destroyed by Sonny twice but in their first fight he gave Liston fits initially. He was bobbing and weaving in a crouch and Sonny kept missing. Floyd never countered to the body or chin each time Sonny missed and left himself open. He admitted later he was too scared but he had opportunities there to get in some good counter hooks both upstairs and downstairs.

Now imagine if it were Tyson there instead of Floyd. When Liston misses a wild left hook, Tyson would duck, land a body shot then come up with an uppercut. Tyson would capitalize on Sonny’s mistakes.

I still favor Sonny over Tyson...I’m just saying Tyson’s chances would be better against Sonny than Louis. Louis made far fewer mistakes.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Rosco
In reply to this post by Will69
Will69 wrote
Chris Byrd defeating a prime Mike?  That one may be pushing it, IMHO.  Tyson, in his prime, was a lot more slippery himself than he was in the 90s, and could come at you from anywhere, unlike Tua.  I think Byrd would be Koed in 8.  Chris wouldn't have the height to escape Tyson's bombs.  Also, I think people are forgetting that I'm talking about a prime Tyson here.  Not the Tyson that was the pay-check fighter, and mentally imploded in the 90s.  The Tyson I'm talking about battered Berbick for 4 rounds and put him on the canvas a few times.  And Berbick went 15 rounds against a prime Holmes!  This is also the Tyson that beat up Holmes and put him down several times before knocking him TFO!  (Something Holyfield couldn't remotely do).
Tillis frustrated peak Tyson. He was not knocked out by him either. Chris Byrd would only do it better. Much better.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Malik Wright
In reply to this post by Duggerman
Duggerman wrote
I’m more confident in Louis beating Mike than Sonny. Tyson fought in predictable patterns that Louis and his trainer Jack Blackburn would LOVE to exploit. Louis had hands just as fast as Mike and had the same accuracy and explosive power in both fists. Against Louis, Tyson would be fighting a tougher, much more technically skilled, smarter and more rounded version of himself. There is always the chance Tyson surprises Louis and scores a sudden knockout but Louis had too much in his arsenal and would be wise enough to get off first.

Regarding Sonny, he is a favorite over Tyson too. Tyson was quoted once saying that the one heavyweight who might intimidate him would be Sonny. But with Tyson’s much faster hands it’s possible he surprises Sonny and scores a sudden knockout.

Think of this also...Floyd Patterson (another peek-a-boo fighter) may have been destroyed by Sonny twice but in their first fight he gave Liston fits initially. He was bobbing and weaving in a crouch and Sonny kept missing. Floyd never countered to the body or chin each time Sonny missed and left himself open. He admitted later he was too scared but he had opportunities there to get in some good counter hooks both upstairs and downstairs.

Now imagine if it were Tyson there instead of Floyd. When Liston misses a wild left hook, Tyson would duck, land a body shot then come up with an uppercut. Tyson would capitalize on Sonny’s mistakes.

I still favor Sonny over Tyson...I’m just saying Tyson’s chances would be better against Sonny than Louis. Louis made far fewer mistakes.
I’m sorry AJ but Louis wouldn’t make it against Tyson. He might beat up the faded version after prison but not the young Tyson.
Malik El Debarge Wright
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Phantom Punch
In reply to this post by Will69
No one has mentioned Ray Mercer? He had a chin of absolute granite and was a friggin relentless monster when he had his game face on.

David Tua would also give Mike a run for his money. Maybe Tommy Morrison too. There’s a reason Mike avoided these dudes in the ‘90s.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

49-0
In reply to this post by Entaowed
Entaowed wrote
Tyson would avoid enough shots that even a high volume Tua would not outland him
How do you know that?  These guys are similar in size and fight toe to toe. They would be bobbing and weaving into each other’s punches!! For example, say Tua ducks a Tyson hook but then Tyson lands a big uppercut the second Tua ducks. Tyson would land flush! There’s no way these two could “avoid each other.” Someone is getting knocked out here.

BUT I feel that Tua would outpunch Tyson. Think about how many record-breaking blows Tua landed on Ibeabuchi? Compare this to Tyson who almost ALWAYS threw a combination then paused and let people clinch him?? I say David Tua beats Mike up.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Duggerman
Administrator
In reply to this post by Phantom Punch
Phantom Punch wrote
No one has mentioned Ray Mercer? He had a chin of absolute granite and was a friggin relentless monster when he had his game face on.

David Tua would also give Mike a run for his money. Maybe Tommy Morrison too. There’s a reason Mike avoided these dudes in the ‘90s.
The best Tyson beats the best Mercer imo. But if they both fought in '96 I'd say Mercer wins.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Zombies Ate Me
Would young Tyson beat anyone under 6'3? Likely so, considering if you're under 6'3 then you're low enough to get smashed on the chin. I'm not saying that he knocks out anyone under 6'3 (he failed to knock out James Tillis for example) but a victory would still be attainable. If you are 6'4 or higher then you could use your arms to wrap him up and that's when Tyson would struggle.
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Leo the Lion
In reply to this post by Entaowed
I believe Holy to be miles ahead of Tyson at any weight. A counter puncher of his magnitude is too great. You can't frustrate Holyfield and starting strong and applying pressure don't make it difficult for counterpunchers, in fact they quite prefer that. Look at the battles with Qawi.

Tyson was great no doubt, but unfortunately his best was against tomato cans. If a guy knocks out a tomato can spectacularly, its still just a tomato can, but people like to hype it. Ask Evolution, I'm sure he agrees.

Hardly anyone beats Holy, unless they're 6ft5 240 lbs and champion - Riddick Bowe and Lewis. Otherwise he dances and stings circles around you.
Leo Rothmann - Amateur Boxer 183lbs
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Leo the Lion
In reply to this post by Rosco
Dunno if Lewis could handle Tyson's physicality. Guy was very strong and solid. Otherwise I favor Louis, because the wan was sharp and lightning fast. Getting goosebumps just thinking of him against Tyson
Leo Rothmann - Amateur Boxer 183lbs
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Re: Would Prime Tyson Beat Anyone Under 6'3"?

Zorro
In reply to this post by Will69
Will69 wrote
  My question is, can you say that a peak Tyson can beat ANY boxer under 6'3" in history?  
Not Liston or Louis. Sorry folks.
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